Forum:Category Trees: Settlements

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Settlements

This is what the wiki has for settlements. In this area there are some decisions that could do with being made (I have highlighted them in bold text).

As Settlements are many in number and Paizo add them all the time, I don't think this is something that is easily set up using a bot. However, setting up these categories for the settlements on the recent Inner Sea map might be a good start, albeit a large task.

If someone creates an article about a settlement, they may set up to 7 categories for categorizing information about it:

  1. Category:S
  2. Category:S/Districts - probably needed only for larger cities
  3. Category:S/Geography - but is this category really needed for Settlements? - only Magnimar has it currently and all geographical features could class as locations within a city >>> Decision. Also, not convinced we need a Geography by settlements category >>> Decision
  4. Category:S/History - but is this category really needed for Settlements? >>> Decision. Only Absalom (which is also a nation) and Korvosa have it so far.
  5. Category:S/Inhabitants
  6. Category:S/Locations
  7. Category:S/Organizations

This is how each category should be written for a Settlement (S) in Nation (N):

Category:S

[[Category:N/Settlements]]

Category:S/Districts

[[Category:S| Districts]]

Category:S/Geography

[[Category:S| Geography]]
[[Category:N/Geography]]

Category:S/History

[[Category:S| History]]
[[Category:N/History]]

Category:S/Inhabitants

[[Category:S| Inhabitants]]
[[Category:N/Inhabitants]]
[[Category:Inhabitants by settlement]]

Category:S/Locations

[[Category:S| Locations]]
[[Category:N/Locations]]

Category:S/Organizations

[[Category:S| Organizations]]
[[Category:N/Organizations]]

City Districts

For a City District (CD) in Settlement, S, for the page [[Category:CD]] use the following format for the contents of the page:

[[Category:S/Districts]]

For a City District (CD) in Settlement, S, the following is a general guide to a page required called [[Category:CD/y]]:

[[Category:CD| y]]
[[Category:S/y]]

For example,

[[Category:Coins| Locations]]
[[Category:Absalom/Locations]]
should this tree also include categories for things like actual businesses, IE:I included the category "Taverns" when I worte the Publican House article, but I see none of the other taverns written up have it. I think it would be a good thing to be able to list the taverns/general stores/theaters/mapmakers/booksellers/ect by the type of business, (and those are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head that would have at least 2 entries)

I like your idea - have a look at Category:Buildings - this was my attempt to do what I think you are requesting. It is not quite the same as it is building focused not business focused - may be now having both might be confusing - what do you think?

I had a look at Publican House and amended it - see what you think. I have changed your categories to existing types of categories but I hope within the spirit of what you wanted.

Inns versus Taverns - debate??? I chose inns you chose taverns - to have both is definitely a cause of confusion and there are pubs and alehouses etc etc. Never sure what to do here - we could change the category to 'Inns and Taverns' or even more vanilla 'Drinking establishments'.

Temples I think should go with the deity and then get collected at Category:Temples - have a look.

You can add new businesses / buildings to Category Buildings as well like general stores/mapmakers/booksellers (theatres are there already). I have just used Shops so far but I suppose you could add each type of shop to Category:Shops, which in turn is part of Category:Buildings. I have updated Basha to show this and so added mapmakers & booksellers. Look ok?

Finally, should we have something like S/Businesses then to get the businesses collected in their settlement as well as by their function? We already have S/Locations which you used which partly does this so adding another subcategory may cause confusion. It's a nice idea - what do others think? My view is it is quite complicated enough now and it is something we may wish to add later if S/Locations and Buildings get too unmanageable.

The reason I originally chose Tavern and not inn was that when I hear inn, I always thing that the place has rooms to rent as well, where I don't think that with pub/tavern/alehouse... either way works for me though

That's because I think you're right: an inn is a pub with rooms. Interestingly I just did an internet dictionary look up of tavern and of inn and it seems an inn is a tavern and vice versa. Not convinced, but it was The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 and I have no idea how good that is:

TAVERN

1. An establishment licensed to sell alcoholic beverages to be consumed on the premises.

2. An inn for travelers.

INN

1. A public lodging house serving food and drink to travelers; a hotel.

2. A tavern or restaurant.

3. Chiefly British Formerly, a residence hall for students, especially law students, in London.

Originally when I did this I considered the blur between inns, taverns, pubs, hotels, B&Bs and restaurants - there are lots of establishments that are sort of in one and a bit in another so chose inns as it seemed distinct from restaurants and hotels but was clearly a drinking establishment to lump all drinking establishments in. I chose restaurant too as that seemed sensible and relatively distinguishable. I have yet to come across a pure hotel but that would seem sensible as a separate category but I'll create it now as we'll need it. B&Bs I've got currently lobbed with Inns - maybe they should go with hotels? hmm.

If we categorize stuff it will make it a lot easier later to break categories up if they become unmanageable so I still think we keep it simple for now and wait and see. If you break inns into inns and tavern/pubs I will not cry though!

I think Cpt Kirstov is right - we need taverns (!); we can all distinguish between tavern, inn, restaurant and hotel I think; And for any ambiguous ones we can always add more than one category. So Category:Taverns now exists and I have transferred all the items in the old Category:Inns appropriately. Paizo definitely seem to make a clear distinction between inn and tavern.

O category master - :) I noticed that there are categories for village, small town, seaport, ect. but it seems that small town is the only one being used. Should we be using the population levels in the GMG for these categories, or should are we using some other means? Should these be in the help page? I'm just thinking of going through the various /settlements categories and adding them,

Hello Cpt kirstov: good spot. I have done some tidying of Category:Settlements:

Have a look. I don't fully understand your comment about Category:Small towns being the only one used though, as many of the other existing categories associated with size of settlement are populated: could you elaborate please? The key thing is that every settlement is most definitely not categorized in this way which does need doing and if you want to help there: splendid. As you suggest, we must use the GMG categorization and match that to our categorization here, no question re that. Also excellent idea of adding this data to the help pages; Help:Writing an article about a place is a very good one as there is nothing there about it. Adding the GMG designations would work fine.

As a separate ponderance, I wonder if that help page really should be two now - one for nation and one for settlement?

Yeah, I caught it because of the 'looking for a town like hommlet' post on the board yesterday, I tried to use the village category to find more examples with full writeups. I agree splitting that page up might be the way to go.

also the Settlements of the Inner Sea region page is going to be an awesome help for this. Notes from the GMG:

Settlement Type Population Range

Thorp Fewer than 20

Hamlet 21–60

Village 61–200

Small town 201–2,000

Large town 2,001–5,000

Small city 5,001–10,000

Large city 10,001–25,000

Metropolis More than 25,000